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Former ATF Agent to Speak at Anti-gun Group's Event - 3/10/19 - Lexington Library

eye95

Well-known member
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Jan 6, 2010
Messages
13,524
Location
Fairborn, Ohio, USA
It should be the goal or our interactions with police also. I just finished reading the entire thread about a Beavercreek carrier interacting with a cop he knew. His stated goal was a big payday. My three interactions with the Montgomery, AL police resulted in a change in policy and behavior. That was the goal.

Sometimes, though, we get stuck in our echo chamber, either validating each other’s ideas or, at most, trying to get them be as extreme as ourselves. That accomplishes nothing.

The number one thing that forums such as this one can do is help us organize meetings in public, where we have a shot at changing hearts and minds of people who essentially disagree with us!

Folks should not tear us down for having done so (or “like” posts that tear down). They should join in (or, at least, cheer on the efforts).

Unless actually changing hearts and minds is not one’s objective. In that case, echo away!
 

solus

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Aug 22, 2013
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here nc
It should be the goal or our interactions with police also. I just finished reading the entire thread about a Beavercreek carrier interacting with a cop he knew. His stated goal was a big payday. My three interactions with the Montgomery, AL police resulted in a change in policy and behavior. That was the goal.

Sometimes, though, we get stuck in our echo chamber, either validating each other’s ideas or, at most, trying to get them be as extreme as ourselves. That accomplishes nothing.

The number one thing that forums such as this one can do is help us organize meetings in public, where we have a shot at changing hearts and minds of people who essentially disagree with us!

Folks should not tear us down for having done so (or “like” posts that tear down). They should join in (or, at least, cheer on the efforts).

Unless actually changing hearts and minds is not one’s objective. In that case, echo away!
13577

Eye95, with absolutely no context or reference cite whatsoever to your post, some might just perceive their listening to a current/past/make believe WHIO newspeek news cast!
 

Ghost1958

Regular Member
Joined
Nov 5, 2015
Messages
1,265
Location
Kentucky
It should be the goal or our interactions with police also. I just finished reading the entire thread about a Beavercreek carrier interacting with a cop he knew. His stated goal was a big payday. My three interactions with the Montgomery, AL police resulted in a change in policy and behavior. That was the goal.

Sometimes, though, we get stuck in our echo chamber, either validating each other’s ideas or, at most, trying to get them be as extreme as ourselves. That accomplishes nothing.

The number one thing that forums such as this one can do is help us organize meetings in public, where we have a shot at changing hearts and minds of people who essentially disagree with us!

Folks should not tear us down for having done so (or “like” posts that tear down). They should join in (or, at least, cheer on the efforts).

Unless actually changing hearts and minds is not one’s objective. In that case, echo away!

The RTKABA is a right. I'll teach anyone to shoot ,safety etc that is interested but totally unfamiliar with firearms
That said I have 0 interest in " intetacting " with self proclaimed anti RTKAB morons.

You change no minds , and regardless what facts you try to use they will be swept aside like leaves.

They are the enemy of the constitution. At one I swore to defend. Interacting with them is futile. Defeating them totally is the goal.
 

eye95

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Fairborn, Ohio, USA
If you try to change minds, you might fail to do so.

If you don’t try to change minds, you will fail to do so.

I know that I have changed minds within the Montgomery, AL police department. The results are well-documented.
 

Ghost1958

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Messages
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Kentucky
If you try to change minds, you might fail to do so.

If you don’t try to change minds, you will fail to do so.

I know that I have changed minds within the Montgomery, AL police department. The results are well-documented.

Cite? If your changing police dept mind about guns is well documented should be easy to cite.
 

eye95

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Messages
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Fairborn, Ohio, USA
You can find the threads on the encounters in the Alabama section. Any of the posters from the Montgomery area will attest to the successes.

But, you just go ahead and cast doubt. You do you.
 

Ghost1958

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Kentucky
Ci
You can find the threads on the encounters in the Alabama section. Any of the posters from the Montgomery area will attest to the successes.

But, you just go ahead and cast doubt. You do you.
Cite please as required by forum rules? Unless its not possible.
 

solus

Regular Member
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here nc
If you try to change minds, you might fail to do so.

If you don’t try to change minds, you will fail to do so.

I know that I have changed minds within the Montgomery, AL police department. The results are well-documented.

You know eye95, i just used my browser to seeking “eye95’s well documented results w/montgomery AL PD” and the search turned up NADA!

Tag mate you it, as YOU brought it up, so put up! Or it is hearsay ~ PERIOD!
 

gutshot II

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Messages
782
Location
Central Ky.
There is nothing in the forum rules that requires a person to cite other posts. Why do people try to enforce non-existent rules? It's like cops trying to enforce laws that don't exist. Here is the rule:
(5) CITE TO AUTHORITY: If you state a rule of law, it is incumbent upon you to try to cite, as best you can, to authority. Citing to authority, using links when available, is what makes OCDO so successful. An authority is a published source of law that can back your claim up - statute, ordinance, court case, newspaper article covering a legal issue, etc.

Apparently, some of us don't know the rules.
 

Ghost1958

Regular Member
Joined
Nov 5, 2015
Messages
1,265
Location
Kentucky
There is nothing in the forum rules that requires a person to cite other posts. Why do people try to enforce non-existent rules? It's like cops trying to enforce laws that don't exist. Here is the rule:
(5) CITE TO AUTHORITY: If you state a rule of law, it is incumbent upon you to try to cite, as best you can, to authority. Citing to authority, using links when available, is what makes OCDO so successful. An authority is a published source of law that can back your claim up - statute, ordinance, court case, newspaper article covering a legal issue, etc.

Apparently, some of us don't know the rules.


Just requiring what is required of me.

He stated there a police department in Alabama changed its regulations and or policies due to his input. And that those changes are well documented.

That is more than a simple post. It is a statement that an entire police dept made well documented changes to their SOP concerning firearms due to his actions.

Apparently some don't know the difference between a simple post, and a claim to have caused a change in a PD SOP ,single handedly.
 

color of law

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Cincinnati, Ohio, USA
There is nothing in the forum rules that requires a person to cite other posts. Why do people try to enforce non-existent rules? It's like cops trying to enforce laws that don't exist. Here is the rule:
(5) CITE TO AUTHORITY: If you state a rule of law, it is incumbent upon you to try to cite, as best you can, to authority. Citing to authority, using links when available, is what makes OCDO so successful. An authority is a published source of law that can back your claim up - statute, ordinance, court case, newspaper article covering a legal issue, etc.

Apparently, some of us don't know the rules.
Well, it all depends. Are you viewing the rule narrowly or expansively. Policy is treated as law of the case. eye95 claims that he influenced, enforced or effected policy in some way. And if the policy was changed, modified, defined or redefined in someway then that would fall within the rule.
 

eye95

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Joined
Jan 6, 2010
Messages
13,524
Location
Fairborn, Ohio, USA
...
He stated there a police department in Alabama changed its regulations and or policies due to his input. And that those changes are well documented.
...
Folks, if you want to know what I wrote, please read my post. This post does not accurately represent what I wrote. Thank you.

Oh, BTW, I would have responded to adult requests for cites.
 

Ghost1958

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Messages
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Location
Kentucky
I know that I have changed minds within the Montgomery, AL police department. The results are well-documented.

OK. There is the quote. Either you caused documented changes in the Montgomery Alabama PD or you did not and there is no documentation .

If you changed two cops minds in the department, yay for you, but that would hardly be " well documented'.

Either there is official documentation or there isn't . By your "adult " response, I must assume there isn't.

Personally I don't much care . But adults realize there is a huge difference between hearsay posts on a internet forum , and something being " well documented "

Fairly easy. Don't claim documentation when there isn't any.
 

eye95

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Messages
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Fairborn, Ohio, USA
Still not reading my words correctly. Please try again.

Yes, I know that this response shows you no respect as an adult. Want it? Give it.
 

Ghost1958

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Messages
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Location
Kentucky
I have no illusions about their feelings toward us, but acting civilly toward a person for whom you have little regard is a sign of maturity and character. I admire their organizational skills and their willingness to fight for their beliefs, even though I think they are mistaken. They will, at some point, become a force to be reckoned with. The gun owners of Ky. continue to bury their heads in the sand in the belief that nothing bad can happen. It will be a rude awakening someday. MDA's influence continues to grow and if they can elect more like-minded candidates, gun owners will be faced with serious problems and many of the weak-kneed progun legislators will abandon the cause for self preservation.
It is obvious from today's meeting that they have a long way to go before they can "talk guns" with any knowledgeable person, but they can learn and are trying to do so. Can we learn what they already know how to do? Is there any interest in us trying to do so? I don't see any evidence of either of those things.

The only people who's influence the mad mop heads grows with is the tiny handful of socialists in power in Jefferson county.

And some guys who want to go rub elbows with them at their meetings which does NOTHING, except possibly make the weak minded think a few gun owners think the soccer moms have some point.

By your own words , you and those with you accomplished nothing.

Getting organized isn't hard. If your position is supported by most gun owners . It is if not.
 

color of law

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Joined
Oct 7, 2007
Messages
5,936
Location
Cincinnati, Ohio, USA
Still not reading my words correctly. Please try again.

Yes, I know that this response shows you no respect as an adult. Want it? Give it.
Nobody is misreading your post. If people misread your post it is because you didn't write it clearly. It's not our problem, it's you poor writing sills.
 
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