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Billy Club, as it pertains to Act 35

davegran

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May 1, 2009
Messages
1,563
Location
Cassville Area -Twelve Miles From Anything, Wiscon
Some interesting history and observations on billy clubs.
These impact weapons are a rarity in law enforcement these days, with many agencies nationwide getting rid of them over the years in response to allegations of police brutality and lawsuits. Other large police departments concluded the weapons weren't effective and banned them in favor of batons.
 

Badger Johnson

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Jan 12, 2011
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USA
...there was an issue as to whether or not a "tire bob", or club had a tether. If it could not be knocked out of your hand was the concern, and defined it's purpose. Tethered, it could be considered a weapon in some states.

For the purpose of fighting, I want a tether. The club can be released allowing a free hand and still maintain retention of the club. boar out.

Against someone with skill (FMA) a club with a tether is a bad idea.

A couple thoughts.
1. Train with a blunt weapon, various lengths, but don't carry - there are opportune items lying all around you. (Rolled up magazine, tree branch, etc.) It's the training and reflexes, NOT the weapon;
2. For people with tough jobs who need an 'edge' there are a lot of ways. Wear a long leather gauntlet, like a wrist brace. Sew lightweight aluminum struts inside your sleeve (using a thin inner sleeve so they can be removed) and use those to block, parry or strike;
3. Use tactical objects with non-obvious uses, like a cane, tactical umbrella (google), musical baton, long Phillips screwdriver, metal ruler, coins in a sock to avoid detection and prosecution;
4. Consider that being charged with having these things are often used as 'pile on' charges if you are a bad actor. Average nice guy with a knife - no problem. BG with a sharpened screwdriver - problem;
5. The best 'weapon' is SA, practice, and the three S's rule.

Don't know if this solves your problem, but an idiot with a club is still an idiot - it's your intent, training, moral high ground.

$.02
 

wild boar

Regular Member
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Apr 2, 2011
Messages
445
Location
wisconsin
Mr Johnson:

I would conceder any close encounter against the discipline of MA a bad idea. As far as clubs go, one would not be my first choice for hand to hand. A empty pistol is more easily controlled, and effective. Lets be careful out there, boar out.
 

Badger Johnson

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1,213
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USA
I would conceder any close encounter against the discipline of MA a bad idea. As far as clubs go, one would not be my first choice for hand to hand. A empty pistol is more easily controlled, and effective. Lets be careful out there, boar out.

Well, you can't tell upon meeting up with an individual if they are trained in any martial art, though there are some 'tells'. I was just cautioning on having it attached to you with a lanyard. If you do so, loop it like you do a ski pole - your hand goes through it to grip but not the thumb.

Actually for a medium range encounter, I would not use a 24" billy/club/stick as a club, I'd use it in a short spear mode, or 'interrupt/preemptive' to the center-line or shoulder crease, or even hip. You use it to keep the opponent back, you don't try to 'clobber' him. (Gene LeBell has a whole book on using a short club as a submission aid.)
51JZRFNFZJL._SS500_.jpg

As a preemption tool, you're keeping him from advancing, while not inflicting injuries. (It's very hard to hit a moving target just right with a truncheon, billy club used in an 'arc'. If the guy is down and 'needs' to be out a short club can be a finishing or KO blow when you have a clear target and the guy's bent over.)

I assume you are envisioning using an empty pistol as a club, above. That's an option always to keep in mind but again, polymer framed guns, not so good here - in fact you could break your gun. A steel framed pistol, or revolver would be better, but I don't know how hard it is to pistol whip a non-compliant moving subject.

Anyway, prob. more than you want to know.
 
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wild boar

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Apr 2, 2011
Messages
445
Location
wisconsin
Not at all Mr Johnson.

You are correct in the tells of discipline. The eyes, a stone sober awareness, even transfer of body weight to allow needed transitions...

My choice in a pistol was the M-9, solid steel alloy. At close range probing to various areas of maximum affect will result in a very disappointed bad guy. The determining factor is the increased PSI. boar out.
 
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