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Massive publicity follows Green Bay open carry picnic!

Interceptor_Knight

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J.Gleason wrote:
Interceptor_Knight wrote:

The former British "subjects" who became felons by firing upon the British Regulars were united in a common interest to be self governing. The Revolution began in their hearts and minds long before those shots were fired on April 19th 1775 .
You may call them felons, I and many others call them Patriots!

Because of their efforts, we have what they fought and died for.
And I for one am not willing to compromise or submit to a compromise to enjoy any of the inalienable rights handed down to us from our fore fathers.

The current revolution needs to be expressed at the polls. Our "rights" and "liberties"have been steadily eroded over the past 200+ years. You can not expect to ignore this and be successful.

The problem with the polls is, the elected officials who have lied and cheated their way into office as well as during their time in office have no interest in what is determined at the polls.

The purpose of pointing out the fact that they were felons in the eyes of the crown illustrates that they were truly revolting and not just protesting. They were taking a stand to become self governing.

The inalienable right in discussion is the right to life. We have an inalienable right to defend ourselves. Until the SCOTUS rules that the 2nd is absolute, we will be subject to restrictions of it.

The polls I refer to are the election polls. These elected officials must be voted out of office. Our system of government would collapse if they were to be removed by the methods used on April 19th 1775.
 
M

McX

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Congratulations on a successful event! I'm glad to see the weather cooperated, and you received good press as well. I'm sorry I couldn't attend the event- had to work. But hopefully we'll see another event planned for the SouthEastern Wisconsin area sometime soon. I'm very proud of all of you, and the supreme efforts you put forth, even in daily OC awareness. You all can count on my continued support!
 

ixtow

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Interceptor_Knight wrote:
Our system of government would collapse if they were to be removed by the methods used on April 19th 1775.
PRECISELY!!

Since the method of government that was implemented in 1776 has ceased to be, it is only natural that what it has become must cease to be in order to restore legitimate government... The two concepts are mutually exclusive.

The fear of bridging that gap is why we all sit about on our hands instead of taking the inevitable action.

Lack of government is not, as Statists argue, Anarchy. The only place Anarchy has been observed, is in 3rd world despots; a form of Government.

Even if it were true or possible (human nature will not allow it), Anarchy would still be a great improvement over what we currently have. So the "anarchy would follow" argument is an absolute failure of both logic and fact.
 

ixtow

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Though the point is sure to be ignored...

Since the media is editing out all the important stuff, having the media present isn't really helping.

'We' need to do our own interviews. We need to do out own news spots. Stop relying on them to provide the sound bites when we can easily do it ourselves.

For everyone who has, or wishes they had, been interviewed; why not just do your own? Digital Video cameras are CHEAP. You know the questions you were asked, you know the answers you gave. Re-create it in your own media. How many people are at these picnics? One can't hold a camera and repeat the same interviews the 'news' leaves on the cutting room floor?

You guys are missing the boat, bigtime. How many times does it have to happen before you go over their heads with your own interviews? Why isn't this being planned in every state's forum?

If the media is neutering the message; cut them out of the loop, just like they cut out your comments. It is easy.
 

Interceptor_Knight

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ixtow wrote:
Since the method of government that was implemented in 1776 has ceased to be, it is only natural that what it has become must cease to be in order to restore legitimate government... The two concepts are mutually exclusive.

The fear of bridging that gap is why we all sit about on our hands instead of taking the inevitable action.

I can not agree with you. We must maintain what we have and fix it from within. The action you allude to is most definitely not inevitable and if it were to be attempted now, it would be very short lived.

Bridge the gap to what? Nothing better currently exists on the planet. It is the people showing up at the voting booths and the people they are electing which is the problem, not our system of government.
 

GLOCK21GB

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Interceptor_Knight wrote:
ixtow wrote:
Since the method of government that was implemented in 1776 has ceased to be, it is only natural that what it has become must cease to be in order to restore legitimate government... The two concepts are mutually exclusive.

The fear of bridging that gap is why we all sit about on our hands instead of taking the inevitable action.

I can not agree with you. We must maintain what we have and fix it from within. The action you allude to is most definitely not inevitable and if it were to be attempted now, it would be very short lived.

Bridge the gap to what? Nothing better currently exists on the planet. It is the people showing up at the voting booths and the people they are electing which is the problem, not our system of government.
I also have to agree with Interceptor on this, if we were to have a revolt now, this country would burn & chaos would ensue for years after. eventually order would be restored but only after everything was destroyed, and millions died. We must retake our government through elections. We just are not to the point of no return yet.
 

ixtow

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Glock34 wrote:
Interceptor_Knight wrote:
ixtow wrote:
Since the method of government that was implemented in 1776 has ceased to be, it is only natural that what it has become must cease to be in order to restore legitimate government... The two concepts are mutually exclusive.

The fear of bridging that gap is why we all sit about on our hands instead of taking the inevitable action.

I can not agree with you. We must maintain what we have and fix it from within. The action you allude to is most definitely not inevitable and if it were to be attempted now, it would be very short lived.

Bridge the gap to what? Nothing better currently exists on the planet. It is the people showing up at the voting booths and the people they are electing which is the problem, not our system of government.
I also have to agree with Interceptor on this, if we were to have a revolt now, this country would burn & chaos would ensue for years after. eventually order would be restored but only after everything was destroyed, and millions died. We must retake our government through elections. We just are not to the point of no return yet.
Some people recognize the futility of repeating the same actions over and over, expecting a different result. Some don't.

Freedom has never come from an election. It is gradually and slowly lost by them.

Such is the nature of what is being voted for; politicians.

I prefer to distance myself from people who still cling to the notion. Of course, that also makes me their first victim...

The point of no return was reached at the very first vote. Democracy is simply the slowest path to the inevitable.

Human Stupidity is as abundant as hydrogen, and has the same gravitational effects as well...
 

GLOCK21GB

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ixtow wrote:
Glock34 wrote:
Interceptor_Knight wrote:
ixtow wrote:
Since the method of government that was implemented in 1776 has ceased to be, it is only natural that what it has become must cease to be in order to restore legitimate government... The two concepts are mutually exclusive.

The fear of bridging that gap is why we all sit about on our hands instead of taking the inevitable action.

I can not agree with you. We must maintain what we have and fix it from within. The action you allude to is most definitely not inevitable and if it were to be attempted now, it would be very short lived.

Bridge the gap to what? Nothing better currently exists on the planet. It is the people showing up at the voting booths and the people they are electing which is the problem, not our system of government.
I also have to agree with Interceptor on this, if we were to have a revolt now, this country would burn & chaos would ensue for years after. eventually order would be restored but only after everything was destroyed, and millions died. We must retake our government through elections. We just are not to the point of no return yet.
Some people recognize the futility of repeating the same actions over and over, expecting a different result. Some don't.

Freedom has never come from an election. It is gradually and slowly lost by them.

Such is the nature of what is being voted for; politicians.

I prefer to distance myself from people who still cling to the notion. Of course, that also makes me their first victim...

The point of no return was reached at the very first vote. Democracy is simply the slowest path to the inevitable.

Human Stupidity is as abundant as hydrogen, and has the same gravitational effects as well...
Seeing as this country was originally formed as a republic, and then about 120 years ago or so, it became a democracy & slowly or rights are being erroded. I do agree with a few of your points& I am not saying a revolt won't everhappen, but if it does , what this country looks like for many years will be very ugly.
 

ixtow

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Glock34 wrote:
ixtow wrote:
Glock34 wrote:
Interceptor_Knight wrote:
ixtow wrote:
Since the method of government that was implemented in 1776 has ceased to be, it is only natural that what it has become must cease to be in order to restore legitimate government... The two concepts are mutually exclusive.

The fear of bridging that gap is why we all sit about on our hands instead of taking the inevitable action.

I can not agree with you. We must maintain what we have and fix it from within. The action you allude to is most definitely not inevitable and if it were to be attempted now, it would be very short lived.

Bridge the gap to what? Nothing better currently exists on the planet. It is the people showing up at the voting booths and the people they are electing which is the problem, not our system of government.
I also have to agree with Interceptor on this, if we were to have a revolt now, this country would burn & chaos would ensue for years after. eventually order would be restored but only after everything was destroyed, and millions died. We must retake our government through elections. We just are not to the point of no return yet.
Some people recognize the futility of repeating the same actions over and over, expecting a different result. Some don't.

Freedom has never come from an election. It is gradually and slowly lost by them.

Such is the nature of what is being voted for; politicians.

I prefer to distance myself from people who still cling to the notion. Of course, that also makes me their first victim...

The point of no return was reached at the very first vote. Democracy is simply the slowest path to the inevitable.

Human Stupidity is as abundant as hydrogen, and has the same gravitational effects as well...
Seeing as this country was originally formed as a republic, and then about 120 years ago or so, it became a democracy & slowly or rights are being erroded. I do agree with a few of your points& I am not saying a revolt won't everhappen, but if it does , what this country looks like for many years will be very ugly.
I don't think a revolt, even a violent one, has to be ugly. Try to remember that all the 'anarchy' you see on TV occurs in barely civilized places.

Geographically, most of the socialist places in this country are huddled urban centers that depend on the surrounding countryside for all of the materials they so ravenously consume.

If secession occurred, county by county, redrawing the borders of what a state is as they go... The islands of blue would rapidly be brought to their knees when their 72 hours of supplies ran out. Those on the coastline would have nothing to trade or buy imports with, as they produce nothing of any worth or use for all the materials they consume.

As it is, the vast breadth of the nation is being dominated by only a few geographic dense population centers which are 100% dependent on those they oppress. What is so wrong about turning the tables and putting them in their place?

On another note; where are the self-conduted 'news interviews? Heck, the the reporters show up, just film over their shoulders and slap it on youtube, so you can link to both the REAL inteview, and the edited version the news uses? Talk about an effective tool for bringing accountability to it. "this is the real thing, this is what the media said" right there side by side....
 

Interceptor_Knight

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ixtow wrote:
The point of no return was reached at the very first vote. Democracy is simply the slowest path to the inevitable.
ixtow wrote:
If secession occurred, county by county, redrawing the borders of what a state is as they go... The islands of blue would rapidly be brought to their knees when their 72 hours of supplies ran out. Those on the coastline would have nothing to trade or buy imports with, as they produce nothing of any worth or use for all the materials they consume.

It's a good thing then that we are not a pure democracy. Although the subject matter of your posts make for interesting discussion, they are purely academic and not based on practical considerations. No political subdivision of the United States has a Constitutional support to secede and therefore would not be allowed to do so without a Constitutional Convention. This line of discussion also has zero to do with Open Carry at this time.

Let's get back to relevant discussion.
 

ixtow

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Interceptor_Knight wrote:
ixtow wrote:
The point of no return was reached at the very first vote. Democracy is simply the slowest path to the inevitable.
ixtow wrote:
If secession occurred, county by county, redrawing the borders of what a state is as they go... The islands of blue would rapidly be brought to their knees when their 72 hours of supplies ran out. Those on the coastline would have nothing to trade or buy imports with, as they produce nothing of any worth or use for all the materials they consume.

It's a good thing then that we are not a pure democracy. Although the subject matter of your posts make for interesting discussion, they are purely academic and not based on practical considerations. No political subdivision of the United States has a Constitutional support to secede and therefore would not be allowed to do so without a Constitutional Convention. This line of discussion also has zero to do with Open Carry at this time.

Let's get back to relevant discussion.
Hence, inclusion of the final paragraph.

"On another note; where are the self-conduted 'news interviews? Heck, the the reporters show up, just film over their shoulders and slap it on youtube, so you can link to both the REAL inteview, and the edited version the news uses? Talk about an effective tool for bringing accountability to it. "this is the real thing, this is what the media said" right there side by side...."

You question the exposure that your own videos would get. And rightly so. But it would be better than nothing. Especially juxtaposed with a copy of the media's edited version.

This is the current shortcoming of 'the movement.' No push back against those who are still framing the issue how they see fit.

Then articles like this get published online, there is usually a comments section. Being able to tag your own videos to show the real story on the very same page as the edited for agenda version, would be a great tool, too.

It has become an information war, and there isn't much effort being done to counter them. Sure, it's cool that they showed up and pointed cameras at you. But they are making you out to be the fools by editing out all the good stuff. It is, as they want it to, doing more harm than good because they are controlling it without rebuttal.
 

Doug Huffman

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The media is framing the issue not to our advantage. The discussion here is being framed when the collegial flow is directed and controlled as otherwise irrelevant. The retort to the media and to others should be, "Oh yeah, says who?"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Framing_%28social_sciences%29

I'll see if I can't find the book describing framing and its uses against conservative issues. ETA: I looked through the references and bibliography of the Wikipedia article and didn't notice any particularly familiar title.
 

ixtow

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I'm not sure an exhaustive definition of it is as important as an effective response to it.

For all the efforts, allowing them to undermine without response, even an ineffective response, is certainly the worst inaction we can take.

Not rebutting their framing is why OCDO has spent money, but not made any legislative progress. It has increased awareness, but to what end? We have a bunch more people with their interest piqued, but our message isn't what they are getting. We paid a lot of good money to raise their interest, but the Leftist message is being fed to them on our tab! They've essentialy 'hijacked the thread' and no one is calling them on it.

We're literally paying thousands of dollars to have the anti's message spread instead of our own.

OCDO needs to add 'real media interviews' to it's agenda, or the fake ones will undermine the whole play. Expound upon the video lnks on the front page, and make an orchestrated attempt to put our own sound-bites in video format. Hundreds of them.

Who knows. I could even appeal to the media's own laziness in rporting; they may just plaigorize our stuff! But they can't do it until we actualy HAVE stuff to plaijorize.

So that numbers 3 ways doing this could be useful.

Even if it is ineffictive: ineffective is still better than counter-productive.
 

GLOCK21GB

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PolishPrince wrote:
I would have most certainly shown up at the picnic, I thought you had to be amember. Great picnic guys! More get-togethers needed like this!
Sept 6th, I am having one at my place. Look at Wisc Stories.
 

Superlite27

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ixtow wrote:
OCDO needs to add 'real media interviews' to it's agenda, or the fake ones will undermine the whole play. Expound upon the video lnks on the front page, and make an orchestrated attempt to put our own sound-bites in video format. Hundreds of them.

Who knows. I could even appeal to the media's own laziness in rporting; they may just plaigorize our stuff! But they can't do it until we actualy HAVE stuff to plaijorize.

I agree 100%

We are doing the same thing over and over, then beating our heads at the same result: The media cuts out the relevant argument we are trying to make.

How many times have I read, "They interviewed me, but cut out the best parts!"

Yet, we still do interviews, then complain about what they air.

We should continue these open carry gatherings, but whenever the media arrives...

FOLLOW THEM AND FILM RIGHT ALONG SIDE THEIR CAMERAS!



Then, post ours on YouTube. We can vigilantly scour the internet for any posting of "their" version, and link to the "real" version whenever possible.

This way, as ixtow suggested, we stop letting them define the issue and take more control of it ourselves.
 
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