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New member, oc'd for first time

Mordis

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BB62 wrote:
ijusam wrote:
BB62 wrote:
I think you have made the right decision. Exercising of RIGHTS is something that people just shouldn't do - bad things may come of it.

It is infinitely better to let those braver (or stupider?) than you "push the limits".

May the master's whip lie softly on your back.
BB62 I think your outta line here. he is exercising his right to self defense. he has taken responsibility for his own personal safety for the past 5 years, which is probably as long as he has been legal to have a LTCH. If he is not comfortable open carrying then fine, its his right. as for "push the limits" that is a personal choice, some are more politically active than others. He is a GUN CARRYING BROTHER, and honest about his fears and motives.
"he is exercising his right to self defense"

No, obtaining an LTCH is NOT exercising a right - it is a request fora privilege.



"he has taken responsibility for his own personal safety for the past 5 years, which is probably as long as he has been legal to have a LTCH"

It is not necessary for him (or anyone else) to carry a gun in order to take responsibility for his personal safety. BTW - LTCH can beissued to 18 year olds in IN.



In a previous post he wrote: "He was nice and polite and i politely told him that In has no law making it illegal to oc"

I'm sorry, but doesn't it seem strange to you that someone who 1) has acquired a LTCH, and 2) knows the law well enough to say "there's no law against it" hasn't fully considered the ramifications of OC? But no, he gets challenged once and all of a sudden the totality of the exposure hits home? How many people do you know that casuallydecide one day "Heck, I'm just gonna OC!". To me it justdoesn't add up.

But, I agree, and I was wrong about one thing - I misread his desire to OC in order to exercisea right, instead it just seems that merely discovering this site a week ago was enough of an "inspiration".

I therefore apologize for and take back my comment "May the master's whip lie softly on your back."


Actually, I did stumble accross this site by accident and decided one day on a whime to oc to see how it was. Despite the fact that the one encounter i had was not a bad one, It still "hit home" the potential consquences. I have oc before, but only as a Uniformed security guard. No one ever questions the security guard standing at his post, or calls the cops on the s/o oc at his post(unless he is acting like a moron).

I think i also stated that i do belive in oc, but i thought i pointed out I was nervous about it due to the fact that sure, its not illegal to oc, but the could still hit you with disturbing the peace, and creating a public nuasance if they felt the urge to do so.

The last thing i need is for my very young son to see his father get slammed to the pavement and taser'd or shot to death by some cop who didnt agree or didnt understand the legalities of open carry. I even visted the fT wayne police dept forums and there was a post about oc, and a rep from the fwp said that the police will come up and talk to run your name and id and stuff. ITs guaruanteed to happen every time a cop sees you in ft.Wayne, its standard policy according to him. They even have a set S.O.P in regards to how they walk talk and act and approach the person.

I practice alot more them most of the police offficers i know, including my uncle who is a 26 year vet, he and most of his colleges(spelling?) only practice enough to qualify. I practice at minimum of 2hours plus twice month, most of the time at least once a week. In that time, i practice my basics, my concealment draw, drawing and firing on the move, instinctive shooting, and front site only shooting. At home i am constantly dryfiring and drawing my unloaded pistol every convienient oppurtunity I get. I do not have the cash to attend gunsite or TDI or the like, so i must make due. I feel i am doing my best to reasonably protect my self. There is no need for the rudeness you are feeding me. '

I would love to get to gether with a someone or group of Hoosiers from this board for a time out on the town oc style, that would go along way to helping my confidence.

I just have a hard time getting the words of the senator out of my head.

"most would consider open carry to be abberent behavior and not something a person of sound mind and judgement would do."

While i whish i could strap both my full size guns on and oc to my hearts content, that senator represents the will of the majority, and that veiw he expresses is most likely the veiws of those he represents. So you must understand were i am coming form.
 

UTOC-45-44

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Feb 22, 2007
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Morgan, Utah, USA
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BB62 wrote:
ijusam wrote:
BB62 wrote:
I think you have made the right decision. Exercising of RIGHTS is something that people just shouldn't do - bad things may come of it.

It is infinitely better to let those braver (or stupider?) than you "push the limits".

May the master's whip lie softly on your back.
BB62 I think your outta line here. he is exercising his right to self defense. he has taken responsibility for his own personal safety for the past 5 years, which is probably as long as he has been legal to have a LTCH. If he is not comfortable open carrying then fine, its his right. as for "push the limits" that is a personal choice, some are more politically active than others. He is a GUN CARRYING BROTHER, and honest about his fears and motives.
"he is exercising his right to self defense"

No, obtaining an LTCH is NOT exercising a right - it is a request fora privilege.



"he has taken responsibility for his own personal safety for the past 5 years, which is probably as long as he has been legal to have a LTCH"

It is not necessary for him (or anyone else) to carry a gun in order to take responsibility for his personal safety. BTW - LTCH can beissued to 18 year olds in IN.



In a previous post he wrote: "He was nice and polite and i politely told him that In has no law making it illegal to oc"

I'm sorry, but doesn't it seem strange to you that someone who 1) has acquired a LTCH, and 2) knows the law well enough to say "there's no law against it" hasn't fully considered the ramifications of OC? But no, he gets challenged once and all of a sudden the totality of the exposure hits home? How many people do you know that casuallydecide one day "Heck, I'm just gonna OC!". To me it justdoesn't add up.

But, I agree, and I was wrong about one thing - I misread his desire to OC in order to exercisea right, instead it just seems that merely discovering this site a week ago was enough of an "inspiration".

I therefore apologize for and take back my comment "May the master's whip lie softly on your back."

"There is no need for the rudeness you are feeding me. "

This is true, although BB62has already "made nice". VERY COMMENDABLE.
 

Mordis

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Ralph, the retired senator im talking about is Ret. Senator Richard Worman. I have known him since ihave been a child.

I personaly dont have a problem with showing my id and permit to a officer who calmly and politely asks me for it. They have no right to lecture on there opinion for or against open carry. As long as they treat me with respect and dont get arrogant(as so many i have met are unfortunately. Tho not all are, so im not broad brushing) and start power trippin. I think i may have to schedual a day were i do nothing but open carry and see how it goes.

ill let you know, but I think we need to schedual a Indiana open carry event of some kind.
 

bobcat

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Aug 19, 2007
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Mordis, I too have recently 'discovered' Indiana firearms laws. I have my Indiana LTCH and I've been CC'g for ~20 years. I was MISINFORMED by a previous Sherrif here to "NEVER let my firearm be seen". He was WRONG. CC and OC is legal with the LTCH. I've been OC'g on occasion for about 6mo in my neighborhood. I regularly OC in the rural West (about four years and 'cause that's where I frequent) where it is legal w/o a permit. I have yet to have a problem anywhere, but I do share your concern for OC in Indiana. The stealth approach of CC is still quite useful, but I do want to be able to OC without being accosted by an LEO, so I am slowly and carefully moving forward with OC.

Which BTW, has not been mentioned on this thread that you must have an LTCH (or accepted out of state permit) to carry CONCEALED or OPEN in Indiana. Not sure if BB62 was aware of that?:) I wish we were an OC without a permit state... I loathe the fact that we have to get a 'permission slip' from the PTB to carry.

Back to OC in Indiana. Having lived here for over 30yrs, I have yet to see but two people OC'g except cops. This does not include the ranges or gunstores. (Yes, I get out frequently:lol:) So, it is safe to conclude it is considered a bit 'odd' by 'societal standards'.:X I intent to help change that, but at the time and place of my choosing, as I am not a hard core activist.

My approach has been slow methodical one, so as not to end up with a court 'invitation', even if it would be a 'charges dismissed'. Before I get too rambunctous with OC, I'll be having casual conversation with some cops I know as well as getting a pro-gun, pro-carry attorney on board so that if something untoward does occur, I'm ready legally to extricate myself as quickly as possible. Kind of hard to find the correct legal council from inside a holding cell. Prudence. Such is the price of freedom.

Mordis, your fears are worth considering, as I know several folks who OC in the West where it is ready accepted. Specifically, two who have been taken to the ground from behind by cops in states where OC is legal WITHOUT a permit or license! (And yes, they were minding their own business and NOT causing any kind of problem.) Both were allowed to 'go free', one after a being disarmed and 'sitting' in a cop car and the other ended up booked, released on his own recognizance and did have to appear in court. Yes, he did 'win' but it cost him time and money. Freedom takes time, money and effort.

Both have a lot of time OC'g and recommend certain approaches, such as being neatly dressed and polite as this, in their experience, minimizes an LEO being a butthead. Both have advised (and others) that one must be prepared to be confronted by a cop. A New Hampshire (gold star state) example:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5FWXnK5UyRI

As well, expect to be approached by the general public and asked things like, WHY? and IS THAT LEGAL? I have only been approached once by a citizen and it was friendly. I believe my approach frequency is due to the rural nature of my carry. And yes, some folks get wierd looks on their faces, just pay them no mind! I will say, I have, so far, heard many more GOOD OC experience stories than bad. We should be encouraged by this.

The idea of a WELL PUBLICIZED OC day in Indiana is an interesting one. OC'g in a group is also an interesting idea, but could be rather intimidating for the masses. (Just a consideration, doesn't mean we should not do it.) At the least we can converse on this site (and others) to 'learn' more about the best ways to exercise our rights, in the time and place of our choosing and the manner we are most prepared.
 

LoveMyCountry

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Joined
Oct 20, 2006
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Mordis wrote:

I think i also stated that i do belive in oc, but i thought i pointed out I was nervous about it due to the fact that sure, its not illegal to oc, but the could still hit you with disturbing the peace, and creating a public nuasance if they felt the urge to do so.

The last thing i need is for my very young son to see his father get slammed to the pavement and taser'd or shot to death by some cop who didnt agree or didnt understand the legalities of open carry. I even visted the fT wayne police dept forums and there was a post about oc, and a rep from the fwp said that the police will come up and talk to run your name and id and stuff. ITs guaruanteed to happen every time a cop sees you in ft.Wayne, its standard policy according to him. They even have a set S.O.P in regards to how they walk talk and act and approach the person.
<snip>

I just have a hard time getting the words of the senator out of my head.

"most would consider open carry to be abberent behavior and not something a person of sound mind and judgement would do."

While i whish i could strap both my full size guns on and oc to my hearts content, that senator represents the will of the majority, and that veiw he expresses is most likely the veiws of those he represents. So you must understand were i am coming form.

Mordis, something to think about. Just a generation or two ago, a black man doing the same thing as you (exercising his rights) would have been treated the same way. I'm sure many a well intentioned relative said the same things as you are being told. Yes, some people were harassed, arrested and many wished they had never left their house. So why did they do it? They stood up for their rights because to not do it was abhorent to them, they had to do it. Not just for themselves, but for all those who wouldn't stand.

You say you worry about your young son seeing his dad being mistreated for doing the right thing. If you don't stand for your rights now, who will stand for his rights when he is a dad? Just think what the oppression will be like for him if things continue as they are. What we do now will be our children's future. What do you want his world to be like?

If you decide that you are not ready for the fight, please support those that will stand in your place. Freedom is never free.

LoveMyCountry
 

Mordis

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Hmm, I may give it a nother shot, LMC made a good point. I do know what k ind of world i want him to grow up in, and it is a gun friendly one. Tho the inevitable will eventually happen IMHO, total europification of america inregards to guns. Tho that is along ways away.

Gonna talk to my father in law, and see if he wants to give go a full day, me and him walking about ft.wayne oc. Tho, i dont know if hell go along with it.
 

bat54r

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Mordis I too live in Fort Wayne and like you I am testing the OC waters. The only places I OC now are to where I shoot, around my neighborhood and to a few of my friends houses. Last week I was returning home from a friends place where we had been shooting most of the afternoon,on my way home I stopped for gas at the Citgo station on Dupont road right in front of the Carmike theaters. I was still OCing and decided to fill my car. I only got one strange look from a woman leaving the Burgerking there and it was just a double take to see if she really saw what she thought she saw, I just smiled and nodded at her and she responded the same. As I was finishing up and ready to get back in my car I noticed a county LEO looking at me soonce again I just smiled and nodded, he just nodded at me and went into Burgerking. So far I have had no problems OCing but like you I am hesitant to push the envelope to far as of yet.
 

Mordis

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Bat54 you and i should meet one saturday afternoon for a good ol time of eatin and shopping.. or what ever else suits our fancy for a couple hours. All the while oc. I know some of the more rapid posters will call me out for not doing it alone, but I just dont feel comfortable doing it alone.

Talked to a FWPD officer that is a neighbor of mine. He said, that while it isnt illegal he reccommends against it. But only becuase if i do go out oc style "he"(as in leo's) will get like 15 911 calls all at the same time about a man with a gun. He said my day would get very complicated. Apparently this has happened here before.
 

TheDeserter

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Been reading the forum for a bit but joined just to comment on the liberal-bashing going on in here.

I'm about as left as they come, which is WHY I am pro-gun. I'm also anti-violence and pro-choice. One of those "An it harm none, do what you will," people.

Just clearing it up that just because someone is liberal doesn't mean they don't support your right to carry a gun, concealed or in the open.
 

Prometheus

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TheDeserter wrote:
Been reading the forum for a bit but joined just to comment on the liberal-bashing going on in here.

I'm about as left as they come, which is WHY I am pro-gun. I'm also anti-violence and pro-choice. One of those "An it harm none, do what you will," people.

Just clearing it up that just because someone is liberal doesn't mean they don't support your right to carry a gun, concealed or in the open.
Sounds to me like you are a Liberterian, not a liberal.

Liberals and gun ownership are totally incompatible. Like neocons and being anti-nation building. You cannot be both. Liberals believe in the state doing everything for them, including defending them.

Many demcorats and republicans are shocked to learn of this thing called 'Liberterianism'.

I once thought I was a republican... hehehe, looking back on it it's quite comical actually.

check this out: http://www.theadvocates.org/quiz.html
 
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