Clear something up for me

[Guest]

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Baradium wrote:

Cpt. Matt wrote:

I'll look around, so far all I've found is that you can be, I think 16, and conceal carry if you hunting, hiking or doing outdoor stuff.

 

Ok, I was a bit off... 

[align=left]Sec. 11.61.220. Misconduct involving weapons in the fifth degree.[/align]

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(a) A person commits the crime of misconduct involving weapons in the fifth degree if the person[/align]

[align=left](3) being an unemancipated minor under 16 years of age, possesses a firearm without the consent of a parent or guardian of the minor;[/align]

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[/align]

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[align=left]This is your general open carry.   You can open carry at 16.   You can also have one under 16 if you have parental consent.    [/align]

[align=left]In the same section, there is a bit about CONCEALED carry.  I quoted the lettered header section again for clarity.[/align]

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[/align]

[align=left](a) A person commits the crime of misconduct involving weapons in the fifth degree if the person[/align]

[align=left]        (6) is less than 21 years of age and knowingly possesses a deadly weapon, other than an ordinary pocket knife or a defensive weapon, that is concealed on the person.[/align]

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[align=left](b) In a prosecution under (a)(6) of this section, it is an affirmative defense that the defendant, at the time of possession, was[/align]

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(1) in the defendant's dwelling or on land owned or leased by the defendant appurtenant to the dwelling; or[/align]

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(2) actually engaged in lawful hunting, fishing, trapping, or other lawful outdoor activity that necessarily involves the carrying of a weapon for personal protection.[/align]

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(c) The provisions of (a)(2) and (4) of this section do not apply to a peace officer acting within the scope and authority of the officer's employment.[/align]

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[align=left]The exemptions are ONLY for (a)6 which is CONCEALED at under 21.   (b) is another section, it's not a header under (6).[/align]

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[align=left]For clarification under this section the tabs work in this form.  (a) (1) (A) (i)[/align]

[align=left]Lower cased letters aren't under any of the text above them, they are only under the basic definition (in this case the phrase: "Misconduct involving weapons in the fifth degree." at the top).  the normal numbers (1) are under the previous letter only, capital letters only under the number above it as well as the lower case letter defining it.[/align]

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[align=left]So,  if you're 16 or older you can carry (under 16 with parental permission).   If you are 21 and over your carrying can be concealed... and there are exemptions to allow you to conceal carry under 21 in certain circumstances.[/align]

Alright, thanks. This helped out alot.

 

[Baradium]

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Cpt. Matt wrote:

Alright, thanks. This helped out alot.

And I hope you also read what NavyLT wrote as well.

You're welcome.

 

[akhunter3]

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Slight thread highjack here, but I was wondering if anyone knew wherein the statutes I could find the laws pertaining to the powers of the 'mall ninja's' a.k.a. security guards?



Specifially I would like to know if they have any legal standing whatsoever in requesting a person to turn over their firearm.





Thanks,



Jon

 

[Baradium]

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akhunter3 wrote:

Slight thread highjack here, but I was wondering if anyone knew wherein the statutes I could find the laws pertaining to the powers of the 'mall ninja's' a.k.a. security guards?



Specifially I would like to know if they have any legal standing whatsoever in requesting a person to turn over their firearm.





Thanks,



Jon

They aren't law enforcement, so of course they don't.

The most that can be asked is for you to leave, and I'm not sure if the guards themselves are legally able to anyway. I'd say the manager would have to do it.

 

[Flintlock]

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akhunter3 wrote:

Slight thread highjack here, but I was wondering if anyone knew wherein the statutes I could find the laws pertaining to the powers of the 'mall ninja's' a.k.a. security guards?



Specifially I would like to know if they have any legal standing whatsoever in requesting a person to turn over their firearm.





Thanks,



Jon

Uh, oh... Is there a story to share?

 

[murphyslaw]

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In the case of the Dimond mall, the security officers ate employed by the mall management. They represent the management and if they ask you to leave that is your warning. The following would constitute criminal trespass if you dont. They do not have the authority to disarm. the only people that have the authority to disarm is a peace officer as outlines in the AAC.

The security Officers have arresting powers to a point.

1) fellony offense in there pressence
2) Fellony offense out of there pressence with propable cause
3) minstomeaner offense in there pressence.

If you are asked to leave and you refuse you have then commited a mistomeaner offnce in there pressence and they have the legal authority to detain you. I would cuff the suspect in a way that elleminated there ability to access there weapon, but I dont have the leagal authority to take it from them.


There is a difference between a security GUARD, and a security OFFICER. As a guard the training is very minimal. As a security OFFICER we have a higher level of training and on many sites act as the private police force. When I am working at the Airport I represent the DHS. and have full arresting powers and searching authority.


Your best bet is to comply with there request and leave the property and file a complant later instead of fighting a mistomeanor offense after you have been picked up by the police and had formal charges brought.

 

[Guest]

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NavyLT wrote:

CPT Matt,

Would you mind explaining to us, please, how you plan on dealing with the FEDERAL law regarding possession of handguns by a person under the age of 18?  You do understand that by stating that you OWN handguns and that your dad GAVE them to you, you are admitting to both of you committing a FEDERAL FELONY?

It's in Title 18, Chapter 44, Section 922, Subsection (x) of FEDERAL law, better known as 18 USC 922:
http://www4.law.cornell.edu/uscode/18/usc_sec_18_00000922----000-.html

(x) (1) It shall be unlawful for a person to sell, deliver, or otherwise transfer to a person who the transferor knows or has reasonable cause to believe is a juvenile— (A) a handgun; or (B) ammunition that is suitable for use only in a handgun. (2) It shall be unlawful for any person who is a juvenile to knowingly possess— (A) a handgun; or (B) ammunition that is suitable for use only in a handgun. (3) This subsection does not apply to— (A) a temporary transfer of a handgun or ammunition to a juvenile or to the possession or use of a handgun or ammunition by a juvenile if the handgun and ammunition are possessed and used by the juvenile— (i) in the course of employment, in the course of ranching or farming related to activities at the residence of the juvenile (or on property used for ranching or farming at which the juvenile, with the permission of the property owner or lessee, is performing activities related to the operation of the farm or ranch), target practice, hunting, or a course of instruction in the safe and lawful use of a handgun; (ii) with the prior written consent of the juvenile’s parent or guardian who is not prohibited by Federal, State, or local law from possessing a firearm, except— (I) during transportation by the juvenile of an unloaded handgun in a locked container directly from the place of transfer to a place at which an activity described in clause (i) is to take place and transportation by the juvenile of that handgun, unloaded and in a locked container, directly from the place at which such an activity took place to the transferor; or (II) with respect to ranching or farming activities as described in clause (i), a juvenile may possess and use a handgun or ammunition with the prior written approval of the juvenile’s parent or legal guardian and at the direction of an adult who is not prohibited by Federal, State or local law from possessing a firearm; (iii) the juvenile has the prior written consent in the juvenile’s possession at all times when a handgun is in the possession of the juvenile; and (iv) in accordance with State and local law; (B) a juvenile who is a member of the Armed Forces of the United States or the National Guard who possesses or is armed with a handgun in the line of duty; (C) a transfer by inheritance of title (but not possession) of a handgun or ammunition to a juvenile; or (D) the possession of a handgun or ammunition by a juvenile taken in defense of the juvenile or other persons against an intruder into the residence of the juvenile or a residence in which the juvenile is an invited guest. (4) A handgun or ammunition, the possession of which is transferred to a juvenile in circumstances in which the transferor is not in violation of this subsection shall not be subject to permanent confiscation by the Government if its possession by the juvenile subsequently becomes unlawful because of the conduct of the juvenile, but shall be returned to the lawful owner when such handgun or ammunition is no longer required by the Government for the purposes of investigation or prosecution. (5) For purposes of this subsection, the term “juvenile” means a person who is less than 18 years of age.

I don't plan on packing until I am 18, just to avoid this very situation. At this point there isn't much I can do about possession, me and my dad both know it's a felony to have them, but I still do, were not worried about since we live in the middle of nowhere, way outside of town.

 

[Baradium]

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And you still think it's a good idea to give all of this information on a public forum?



:banghead:


A present solution, as I understand it, would be to tell your dad that you want them to be his guns until you are legal to own the things, THEN he can give them to you. Especially since you have specifically said you both are aware of the law regarding this.

 

[akhunter3]

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Flintlock wrote:

akhunter3 wrote:

Slight thread highjack here, but I was wondering if anyone knew wherein the statutes I could find the laws pertaining to the powers of the 'mall ninja's' a.k.a. security guards?



Specifially I would like to know if they have any legal standing whatsoever in requesting a person to turn over their firearm.





Thanks,



Jon

Uh, oh... Is there a story to share?

Nah no story, I hit upon a thread over at glocktalk that was bashing the mall ninjas and didn't know what the state laws were regarding them.



Thanks for the info guys:celebrate



OP-:banghead::banghead::banghead::banghead:You aren't exactly winning point for your maturity or abililty to think at this stage in the game. In fact it's kinda sad.



Jon