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Charleston church shooting: 9 killed

Grapeshot

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Eight died at the scene in downtown Charleston, South Carolina; a ninth died at a hospital.

Authorities are calling the incident a hate crime.

The gunman is still at large, police say.

Charleston, South Carolina (CNN)[Latest developments]

• The person who shot and killed nine people at Charleston's Emanuel African Methodist Episcopal Church was there for about an hour, attending a meeting with the eventual victims, before he began shooting, Charleston police Chief Greg Mullen said Thursday morning.
http://www.cnn.com/2015/06/18/us/charleston-south-carolina-shooting/

In South Carolina guns are banned in churches without the specific permission of a church official. End result is that few if any permit carriers would be carrying in church - no one would be able to stop the carnage. Victims were fish in a barrel - sad and totally unacceptable.
 
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MSG Laigaie

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The media seems to be making an issue of the patches on his jacket. They (media) seem to believe these are the badges of racism. Sad that they target his clothing.

Were his drug arrests before his birthday in april? If so, that would make him a prohibited person, not eligible to receive a firearm,eh? Was it an illegal transfer, and the individual who gave it to him gets arrested for it? The possibilities are endless, I better get popcorn.
 

papa bear

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Thanks for the Info GRAPE. I was wondering if the church had been a GFZ. So it is by law. So that means it is the state's fault for this massacre. Interesting

wonder when SC is going to catch up with the rest of America
 

RK3369

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unfortunately.............

Constitutional/Open Carry? It will never while the P4P hegemony persists in South Carolina. Note that one of the victims, the Reverend Senator Clementa Pinckney was a powerful voice against liberalization of civil rights to the RKABA.

were he still alive, he might think differently of it now. Sad, but true. Let it be a lesson to others. You need to be able to defend yourself, period.
 

MAC702

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...Note that one of the victims, the Reverend Senator Clementa Pinckney was a powerful voice against liberalization of civil rights to the RKABA.

Where can we get a cite for that to use it elsewhere?
 

Grapeshot

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In the middle of an article is this an example of the limited vision of a political leader who maybe, just maybe, has had his eyes opened.

"It is senseless, it is unfathomable that somebody in today's society would walk into a church when people are having a prayer meeting and take their lives."
"This is a most unspeakable and heartbreaking tragedy," said Mayor Joe Riley. "People in prayer on Wednesday evening. A ritual of coming together, praying and worshiping God, and to have an awful person come in and shoot them is inexplicable. Obviously, the most intolerable and unbelievable act possible."
http://www.nbc12.com/story/29347341...ing-suspect-dylann-roof-arrested-in-shelby-nc

Now the question remains, will he and others look to pass more friutless laws that only restrict the law abiding OR will they have a true epiphany and let good people be armed so as to have the chance to defend themselves, their loved ones, and their friends/neighbors from such senseless acts?

While a gun is no magic talisman that wards off evil, it is a great potential game changer for honest people when faced with immediate life or death situations that no law will prevent. I have a cell phone, but when bullets come my way, it will not, it must not, be the first tool for which I reach. The object being to stop the individual(s) from taking the lives of innocents.

I am reminded of the New Life Church story (#4) where someone armed stopped/limited the carnage in a church - only possible because they were armed. There are others - I have personal knowledge of the Golden Market (#6) event too.
http://www.buzzfeed.com/ryanhatesth...-that-were-stopped-by-someone-wit#.flnwEvk2EE
 

MAC702

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... I have a cell phone, but when bullets come my way, it will not, it must not, be the first tool for which I reach. ...

How dare you delay the arrival of the guys that have to draw the chalk outlines!
 

utbagpiper

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were he still alive, he might think differently of it now.

Possibly, but--knowing nothing of him and just speaking of people generally--unlikely.

It is human nature to see things through the lens of our preconceived biases and beliefs. We here see this horrific crime as evidence supporting our view that good men need to be armed in self defense.

But those who believe that "easy access to guns" is the cause of criminal violence or at least a major facilitator of it, are likely to view this crime as one more evidence that they are right. If they could just get rid of the guns, such crimes would not occur.

We all know the logically problem with that line of thinking. But most people who are anti-gun hold that position due to emotion, not logic. Don't expect logic to over emotion very often. "Reason is slave to passion."

Obviously, the gun haters including Obama won't let this "tragedy go to waste" as he is already calling for a reevaluation of our gun culture. We need to be prepared to respond on the other side.

Charles
 
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countryclubjoe

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were he still alive, he might think differently of it now.
Possibly, but--knowing nothing of him and just speaking of people generally--unlikely.

It is human nature to see things through the lens of our preconceived biases and beliefs. We here see this horrific crime as evidence supporting our view that good men need to be armed in self defense.

But those who believe that "easy access to guns" is the cause of criminal violence or at least a major facilitator of it, are likely to view this crime as one more evidence that they are right. If they could just get rid of the guns, such crimes would not occur.

We all know the logically problem with that line of thinking. But most people who are anti-gun hold that position due to emotion, not logic. Don't expect logic to over emotion very often. "Reason is slave to passion."

Obviously, the gun haters including Obama won't let this "tragedy go to waste" as he is already calling for a reevaluation of our gun culture. We need to be prepared to respond on the other side.

Charles

+1
Obama the anti that he is, stated, it is just to easy to get a gun these days... I say not that easy for law abiding citizens to get a gun these days... I know some LAC in Jersey waiting over 2 plus years for a permit...
Only criminals have easy access to weapons and easy access to unarmed folks due in part to all the anti laws and regulations..

This was yet another horrible event in a world full of sick crazy people, now we need to make sure that the not so sick crazy people can defend themselves and their loved ones against the crazies..

I say be trained, armed, and ready for danger where ever you go, for a crazy may be around to do you and your family grave harm...

My prayers go out to the families however prayers don't deter bullets, even in a church..

My .02

Regards

CCJ
 

twoskinsonemanns

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What a terrible incident. I read that he reloaded 5 times. 5 times!
I can only imagine the terror these people went through. I wonder if any of them wished for a gun as Mr Crazy reloaded.
**** GFZs.
 

The Truth

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I've read conflicting stories as to whether the shooter passed a background check to obtain the pistol or his father gifted it to him.

Maybe someone has better Google-fu skills than I do.
 

b0neZ

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I've read conflicting stories as to whether the shooter passed a background check to obtain the pistol or his father gifted it to him.

Maybe someone has better Google-fu skills than I do.

The only reports I've read said his dad gave/bought him one for his 21st birthday.
 
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The Truth

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So is this one of those odd cases where some clerk somewhere didn't file proper paperwork to show that the kid was disqualified when his 4473 went through? Was lying on the 4473 good enough to pass the background check?

I'm curious about the facts surrounding the purchase and how he was able to obtain the weapon.
 

MKEgal

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church shooting in SC

By now I'm sure you've all heard about the latest massacre in a "gun-free" zone,
this time a church in SC.

I hadn't heard ANYTHING in the media about whether or not it was legal to carry
in a church in SC, so I went to http://www.handgunlaw.us/
clicked in the SC area to bring up their PDF http://www.handgunlaw.us/states/southcarolina.pdf
and paged through looking for prohibited places.
On page 4 it lists churches, unless the citizen has permission from the church.

Then I clicked the link provided to go look at the SC law directly on their .gov site.
http://www.scstatehouse.gov/code/t23c031.php
and whaddayaknow, but they're right!
See 23-31-215(M)(8)

Wonder why none of the media have mentioned this?
I mean, it's so difficult to find reliable & accurate information...
Took me, a normal citizen, maybe 3 minutes.
A trained reporter shouldn't even take that long.

They couldn't, oh, I don't know... have an agenda or something, could they?

Feel free to post these links on any news site/story.
We need to get the word out, before the ghouls start dancing in the blood of these
latest victims, pushing for more laws.
 

solus

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hindsight being what it is, but another common thread flows through the NGZ mass shootings starting back in Columbine HS...

very few instances are reported where those being shot have attacked the shooter...

in last night's shooting i can understand why the 87yo and 70yo women wouldn't be able to rush the shooter, but early reports states Roof reloaded 5 times.

it is a common theme in these each of these mass shooting instances which truly befuddles me...

grapes example of using personal firearms notwithstanding.

ipse
 
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skidmark

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intentional thread drift

Did the Solicitor just befoul this case to the point that it can never be brought to trial by a jury?

Letting the families and friends of the victims express their feelings about the shooter - not about his being let out on bond - IMHO has poisoned the jury pool not just in Charleston, or even in SC, but probably across the entire country.

Either the fix was in or it was the grossest stupidity. My vote is for stupidity.

Giving the families/friends a forum to express their grief and their willingness to forgive the sinner is good. Deciding to do it as part of a bond hearing? Not so much.

stay safe.
 

solus

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Did the Solicitor just befoul this case to the point that it can never be brought to trial by a jury?

Letting the families and friends of the victims express their feelings about the shooter - not about his being let out on bond - IMHO has poisoned the jury pool not just in Charleston, or even in SC, but probably across the entire country.

Either the fix was in or it was the grossest stupidity. My vote is for stupidity.

Giving the families/friends a forum to express their grief and their willingness to forgive the sinner is good. Deciding to do it as part of a bond hearing? Not so much.

skid, ya'l a book learn'd person...can you explain the stat chart at 1.20 into the video???
I be mighty confused as the numbers doesn't add up to 100% http://www.cbsnews.com/videos/frien...ing-suspect-roof-was-planning-for-six-months/

stay safe.

skid, the national news this evening stated the practice is allowed by SC statutes?? no I have no cite nor inclination to delve into their statutes.

on this vein, I am aghast the nation, from the president down has proclaimed the young man guilty to the point the governor wants him given the death penalty.

finally, the national news proudly proclaimed the young man was put in the next cell from the nice ex policeman who shot the motorist in the back.

back to our regularly scheduled broadcast of coverage of SC's state flags flying at half mast, except the confederate flag flying over the capitol building which can't be lowered due to state statutes.

ipse
 
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