Concealed carry

[Outdoorsman1]

I still wonder what will happen to any chance of getting Constitutional Carry if a Concealed Carry Bill were to pass. And as asked and answered before... If a Conceal Carry Bill were to pass requiring a permit, I suppose the permit would be for Conceal Carry only and Open Carry as we now have it would remain in effect..???

I would like to see the restrictions on transport repealed or amended to be more open carry (handgun) friendly as well as a form of Castle Doctrine that extended to vehicles and your immediate surroundings passed. This, along with the open carry we already enjoy would be close enough (if not equal to) Constitutional Carry, either of which would be fine with me.

I also realized the need for some (myself included) to be able to Conceal Carry in certain situations. It does seem like the powers that be are leaning towards a Concealed Carry W/ permit required...

Lady Glock... Welcome to the group...

Outdoorsman1

 

[AaronS]

I just spoke with someone at Senator Ellis' office. He said there is not a concensus among CC people that will allow for a bill to be passed right away. They have to work out some of the issues between those people who want training involved and those who want to walk up and say "I want it" and get it.

I don't have a problem with the idea of an 6 to 12 hour training session. I've done 12 hours with Colorado...and a 6 hour session in Minnesota.

The person I spoke to believes there will be something brought up later this session or in the Fall. I asked if they could revive the older bill that the govenor wouldn't sign, and he said there were things in that bill that many said they would not support...such as the training requirement. Come on folks...lets get CC on the books. If you want to carry without restrictions, Open Carry. But don't stall the opportunity to get CC in the state while there is a govenor who will sign it!!

We want a good CC bill. We want our right back 100% We don't ask for any less.

I'll stop stalling when you show me your 1st Amendment permit.

If the 2A permit could be about $300, I have to wonder what the 1A permit should be?

 

[civilwarguy]

MAY NOT EVEN HAPPEN THEIS SESSiON?!?!?!?!

I just received this email from my senator..... and all i can say is this is truly a disappointment.


Dear _______,
Thank you for taking time to contact me regarding passing a constitutional carry law for our state.
In regards to any potential conceal and carry legislation session, I don’t know when it will occur, or in what form, but I believe it’s coming. Right now, the focus is job creation and economic development, and numerous other issues are on hold for now, with perhaps the exception of Photo ID to vote legislation. I do support the lifting of the ban on carrying of a firearm while conceal, and have voted accordingly in past sessions. But as you may know, Governor Doyle blocked our efforts through the use of his veto pen.

With the new legislative Majority and a new Governor, I believe Wisconsin will become the 49th state in which a law-abiding citizen may carry a concealed firearm. What I don’t know at this time is what the legislation will look like. Some have talked about a repeal outright, while others have discussed a repeal, but with certain levels of training standards or background in handling a firearm. There has been talk of following other states’ models where certain unforeseen challenges and issues of going in one direction or another have been resolved. An outright repeal of the current ban in Wisconsin could generate some ancillary and unintended consequences, which would also have to be dealt with in tandem with any legislation in this regard. But again, since much of this will probably be occurring later this session, it’s a bit premature to discuss any of that, or what may come to pass.

Still, I will continue my support for conceal and carry legislation in Wisconsin, and hopefully it can be taken care of this legislative session. Again, thank you for writing and please do so on any other matters before the Wisconsin Legislature.

Sincerely,
Neal Kedzie
State Senator
11th Senate District
NJK: ks

 

[Lady Glock]

I still wonder what will happen to any chance of getting Constitutional Carry if a Concealed Carry Bill were to pass. And as asked and answered before... If a Conceal Carry Bill were to pass requiring a permit, I suppose the permit would be for Conceal Carry only and Open Carry as we now have it would remain in effect..???

I would like to see the restrictions on transport repealed or amended to be more open carry (handgun) friendly as well as a form of Castle Doctrine that extended to vehicles and your immediate surroundings passed. This, along with the open carry we already enjoy would be close enough (if not equal to) Constitutional Carry, either of which would be fine with me.

I also realized the need for some (myself included) to be able to Conceal Carry in certain situations. It does seem like the powers that be are leaning towards a Concealed Carry W/ permit required...

Lady Glock... Welcome to the group...

Outdoorsman1

Thank you. I'm glad to be here, and grateful for the other forum friend who recommended this forum.

I don't find any fault in the permit form of CC. It allows the person to have some of the legal background and some safety instruction. I personally would prefer that a person Carrying concealed have the basic knowlege of how to safely handle the gun. I know my preferences don't matter to anyone else but me...

I would be happy if we could get constitutional carry...but it's unlikely that will happen. ANY form of CC is better than none!

 

[Wisconsin Carry Inc. - Chairman]

A few thoughts. Having spoken to heads of a number of groups in Wisconsin over the past several months I've concluded a few things. Most claim to "have a bill drafted".

If I had a dollar for every time I've heard someone say a bill is drafted and ready to be introduced and a 'done deal' I could buy McX a new 1911

No legislation has been introduced, the ball is still in play. Anyone who says otherwise is just trying to make you go away so they have less resistance to their plan.

Lastly, every legislator gets the concealed carry legislation question multiple times a week. They can't make any promises either. They don't want to be wrong and have people on their case.

Continue to make contact with your legislators. Continue to pass along information about constitutional carry advancing in other states to them. Don't believe a word anyone says until a bill is introduced.

 

[Pyro01]

^-- +1000

We already have like 4 different threads in the WI forum with different legislators saying something about a bill being drafted. Best to just keep in contact with them like Nik Clark said.

 

[Snake161]

Yeah. Okay. So this is how this is going to go. Just like every other forum on the internet! Constantly throwing other people under the bus, conspiracy theories, paranoia, judgment.

I think that some of you people's main mission in life is to make enemies!!! WHAT IS THE DEAL?!

IF YOU MUST KNOW, and if you read my post, I DID NOT SAY THAT ANYTHING WAS DRAFTED. NOTHING!!!!!!!!!

The idea is that these two basic requirements SEEM to be floating around; Pay a fee and have a background check conducted. THAT is what I have heard. It seems that this is the consensus and will probably weasel its way into WHATEVER bill is passed.


Many of you are putting words in my mouth and accusing me of being anti-government. I guess if that makes you feel better fine, but it is most certainly not true.

And yes, as a side note to the moderator, it is written into our founding documents. Do I want it to happen? NOT AT ALL. Our way of life and our country would be destroyed. But continue to assume. I just get a kick out of how freedom loving you are but then call what is sewn into our founding documents "illegal activity". I wasn't referring to that right anyway.

AND NO, I AM NOT PHISHING?! I literally don't even know what the true definition of phishing is, let alone trying to implement it! Whatever.....

Protias, Anmut, Handy Hamlet, Apierce918, Outdoorsman.....I really wish you wouldn't set out to attack somebody right away. You prove the point to the liberals that we want to attack what we are afraid of/don't know. You guys are being hypocritical. Not to mention, I would rather not meet any of you if this is the attitude you have. Handy hamlet, you especially. With an attitude like that, I wouldn't feel safe with you carrying around me. And I am not trying to be rude. I'm serious.

I was born and raised in Wisconsin, and I believe I am one of the first to Open carry in Appleton. Everybody else I have talked to is too timid to do it besides a couple of my friends. Don't act like I am some ghost behind a screen. I am part of the carry movement as much as any of you. And I feel that

I am not some sort of an "entrapment" mechanism trying to get you guys to slip up. I am 24 years old, my name is Jake Roberts, I am a Constitutional Conservative, I am in college and work full time to pay for my living. I have nothing to hide.

Stop making accusations and circumventing what I post.

And, the information is from our NRA State legislation liaison Jordan Austin. However, he said that these things could change.

I'm sorry that many of you seem to like to jump to conclusions. I tend to never do that. It is rude, and it does not show a manner of awareness about yourself and others.

A word to the moderator; don't single me out as the fire starter. I am not here to make waves. I am not anti-government as I said before. We have the right to impeach a president for crimes against the people or government. Why did you immediately jump to the conclusion that I was talking about going to arms? Wow. Really makes a person want to be part of the movement.

Glock 34 is the only level headed individual that seems to want to maintain a sense of civility on here. He did not attack me. He actually defended me.

Calico Jack is not far behind. He seems to be objective as well.

It really does not paint a good picture for you guys previously mentioned. Try to be objective instead of right away trying to be in charge and on top of the information. Other people may have a say as well.

Lets try this again; It looks as though we will be required to have a background check and pay a fee to CC. While there is no legislation that has been drafted yet, I have also heard other senators and reps, such as Pam Galloway, saying they support something similar to this.

There is your information. There are your sources. Stop attacking me and being sarcastic.

And, being non-sarcastic, have a good day.

 

[HandyHamlet]

Well Jake, I'm not from Wisco. I'm from a place were bullsh*t does not fly. You don't like being called on it? Then don't do it. There is no reason why you can't be yourself around here. Try it. I might surprise you.

Welcome aboard.

 

[civilwarguy]

OK how about we don't start calling each other names or insulting one another. If any thing presented as fact then i personally see it as each persons duty to check it out to see. That's how we can form our opinions and be individuals instead of just eating what ever is fed to us. that's just my .02 but i do ask that we stop putting one another down as it doesn't help any one.

 

[IcrewUH60]

Op states:

It seems as though the legislation will be a "shall issue" type of legislation. Its still early to declare it as such yet, but this is what's bouncing around. A background check and a fee and your able to carry. Not exactly what we wanted, but it's better than not having the right to carry at all.

I read "it seems" to obviously mean that it's his opinion. Where else would "it seems" be taken as anything else?

Based on what I've been told (my Senator Jon Erpenbach) CC won't happen in WI. That's still just here-say.

 

[Nutczak]

I just spoke with someone at Senator Ellis' office. He said there is not a consensus among CC people that will allow for a bill to be passed right away. They have to work out some of the issues between those people who want training involved and those who want to walk up and say "I want it" and get it.

I don't have a problem with the idea of an 6 to 12 hour training session. I've done 12 hours with Colorado...and a 6 hour session in Minnesota.

The person I spoke to believes there will be something brought up later this session or in the Fall. I asked if they could revive the older bill that the governor wouldn't sign, and he said there were things in that bill that many said they would not support...such as the training requirement. Come on folks...lets get CC on the books. If you want to carry without restrictions, Open Carry. But don't stall the opportunity to get CC in the state while there is a governor who will sign it!!

We do not want the new legislation to be the total piece of crap introduced the last time around. if the PPA bill would not have been vetoed by Doyle, we would have had more restrictions on our 2A rights than we have right now. have you read the old bill?
we are not willing to compromise so quickly just to get a piece of crap bill to go through! We have O-C, and we have some case-law that helps us out right now.
Since I do not have a life due to being self-employed, I conceal-carry at my place of business, and from there to the bank and to my home. Why do I do this even though WI state law says I cannot? Because in one of the cases the WSC stated that is a persons need to carry concealed is outweighed by the states prohibition on the practice, you are ok. If cited, I will just need to prove my needs outweighed the states want to prohibit the act. Since I male bank deposits late at night and I carry large sums of money, My need to defend myslef and my property trumps their wishes IMO.
The economy sucks, people are getting desperate, if I were to be robbed, and injured in the process, it would end my business and that would unemploy several people. So my employees needs to be employed, and my staying open to pay taxes trumps state law!

 

[Outdoorsman1]

Jake... Quote form your original post...

This is what the United States is all about these days; tracking and quantifying and keeping tabs on everybody in the country. Freedom? Right. I wish it wasn't true. I like to consider myself a patriot that stays involved, but everyday, the gov. pushes back and says "No, you are not as free as you think. Sit back down". I see no change to come anytime soon. Even people I have cast my vote for who claimed they love freedom and the constitution are spitting in my face and doing the same crap every other politician does.
The constitution and the deceleration of independence state that we have certain rights when a government becomes too big and unresponsive. Perhaps it is time all citizens across the country who are tired of this invoke that right.


"I wasn't referring to that right anyway."

"Many of you are putting words in my mouth and accusing me of being anti-government. I guess if that makes you feel better fine, but it is most certainly not true."

Jake, if you consider my post (refering to "Zombie") regarding your unwillingness to provide some concrete back up to your original post (after being asked politely by 2 different people) or my making a comment about your post insinuateing that pehaps the people should overthrow the government as attacking you then all I can say is thank goodness I did not (from my point of view) really atttack you or maybe you would have gotten really upset...

Finally, quoting your post one last time...

"I would rather not meet any of you if this is the attitude you have."

Works for me...

Outdoorsman1

PS: ANy mis-spellings or bad use of grammar are either typos or intentional, intended to frustrate anyone reading this that might be college educated and have a thing about such stuff.

PSS: I apologize to my fellow readers of this post for getting off topic in defending myself and in respect to the original topic, this post is all I will have to say on this matter....nuff said...

 

[LR Yote 312]

I just spoke with someone at Senator Ellis' office. He said there is not a concensus among CC people that will allow for a bill to be passed right away. They have to work out some of the issues between those people who want training involved and those who want to walk up and say "I want it" and get it.

I don't have a problem with the idea of an 6 to 12 hour training session. I've done 12 hours with Colorado...and a 6 hour session in Minnesota.

The person I spoke to believes there will be something brought up later this session or in the Fall. I asked if they could revive the older bill that the govenor wouldn't sign, and he said there were things in that bill that many said they would not support...such as the training requirement. Come on folks...lets get CC on the books. If you want to carry without restrictions, Open Carry. But don't stall the opportunity to get CC in the state while there is a govenor who will sign it!!

Trading a Right for a Priviledge isnt working Forward,its working backwards.

You dont want that older bill revived. When Former Gov Doyle refused to sign it he did Wisconsin a huge favor.

The penalty to ANY violation to the conditions was an automatic Felony.
Included were No vehicle carry. Total abstinence of alcohol. Many prescription drugs would cause a refusal.

It made Hawaii's and Commiefornia's anti gun laws look simple.

If I have to pay to sit in a class for 6-12 hours just so I can wear a jacket over my gun....That isnt a Right.

Thats a Tax!!!

And one I dont believe in. I wont be taxed so I can defend myself.

LR Yote

 

[1245A Defender]

well,,,

Any ideas on reciprocity yet? I have MN and non resident PA...if I move to WI and homestead in MN...will I have to get the WI CCW?

i cant even tell what this question asks,,,
where are you now?
how do you home stead in one state, but live in another?
and last, but not least,,, nobody "has to", or "can" get a WI CCW...

 

[Lady Glock]

i cant even tell what this question asks,,,
where are you now?
how do you home stead in one state, but live in another?
and last, but not least,,, nobody "has to", or "can" get a WI CCW...

Homestead= own a home in one state, rent in another due to work.

 

[Running Wolf]

. . . the deceleration of independence . . .


PS: ANy mis-spellings or bad use of grammar are either typos or intentional, intended to frustrate anyone reading this that might be college educated and have a thing about such stuff.

That's the best "mis-spelling" I've seen in quite some time . . .

:lol:

 

[Outdoorsman1]

:lol:

Outdoorsman1

 

[Lady Glock]

That's the best "mis-spelling" I've seen in quite some time . . .

:lol:

Oh man...I proof read alot, and I didn't catch that!!!! :lol:

 

[Trip20]

<snip>.....And, the information is from our NRA State legislation liaison Jordan Austin......<snip>

This is the problem, Snake. You could have divulged this information all along.

With the anonymity of a random screen name on an internet discussion forum, you throw down some cloak-and-dagger claims with an "I could tell you but I'd have to kill you" after taste.... Forgive the skepticism, but when you really consider the circumstances you have to see how people might be a bit skeptical and ask for sources.

Frankly I find it a bit humorous and that you're surprised by the skepticism. It's the "believe half of what you see and none of what you [read]" adage... it's just plain common sense.

 

[Wisconsin Carry Inc. - Chairman]

Thank-fully the members of this forum, and dare I say Wisconsin Carry's members in general have never accepted the path of least resistance, never accepted nuance as a substitute for fact, and never sat around and waited for permission to exercise and achieve the ability to exercise the rights endowed to them by their creator. (whomever you believe your creator to be)

Had we been prone to supposition or acquiesced to practice only the most common-place and widely socially acceptable norms of society, we'd have never holstered up an open-carried handgun and gone about our daily business exercising our constitutional right to be armed for security, defense, recreation, or ANY lawful purpose.

The popular opinion was that open-carry would get you arrested every time. We rolled over that myth and left its carcass in the ditch along the road of freedom. Yes, a couple municipalities didn't read the memo, but they are all massively lighter in the pocketbook because of their ignorance due to paying damage awards and also the huge legal expenses they incurred and are currently incurring as a result of their ignorance of people's rights.

We in this forum know FIRST HAND how a relatively small group of 20 - 50 people, some who did small things and some who did big things, but all who went where others dared not go were able to move the ENTIRE state of Wisconsin into an open-carry stronghold.

The effort of freedom does not exist in the middle of a crowd where one only follows in the footsteps of the person in front of them but at the front of the pack blazing new territory where others either didn't have the balls to go, didn't have the means to travel their, or just plain didn't have the vision to see an opportunity.

A year ago, constitutional carry was a pipe dream. I doubt 99% of legislators in Madison could have told you what it was. I doubt 7 out of 10 gun owners in Wisconsin could have told you what it was. We are not there anymore.

We need not speculate on the progress constitutional carry has made. We have newspaper articles where pro-gun legislators speak of constitutional carry by name as proof. Legislators have shared with me first hand accounts of legislative caucus meetings were the 2 options "shall-issue" and "constitutional carry" were spelled out as the choice to make. We have ALL of the major freedom-minded groups in Wisconsin addressing constitutional carry by name. The massive Wisconsin tea-party/patriot coalition which represents over 100 individual tea-party groups across the state backs constitutional carry. All of the major in-state gun groups either willingly jumped forward to express support for constitutional carry (Wisconsin Carry, United States Concealed Carry Assoc, Wisconsin Gun owners) or been forced by popular demand to address it and in turn expressed support (Wi-Force, NRA). Even the few groups who don't support constitutional carry (WCCA) and others have HAD to address it. (you've seen the emails flying around from guys like Mike Bender who are now on the defensive trying to justify their support for big government)

Since last year at this time we have TWO additional constitutional carry stats (arizona and Wyoming) with a dozen or so others having constitutional carry legislation moving forward at various stages.

LETS BE VERY HONEST HERE. There can be NO DOUBT constitutional carry is the up-and-comer, and shall-issue is the has been.

If you were a stock market investor and shall-issue and constitutional carry were both stocks, which would you invest in? Which is the future?

Everyone is entitled to their opinion. And we all know the cliche's about opinions.

But I'll confidently stand here and say that it doesn't "seem" to me that we will be getting mandatory permits and background checks.

It SEEMS to me that Constitutional Carry didn't show up on the radar a year ago. It was out there, but it wasn't on the radar. It SEEMS to me that constitutional carry showed up on the radar nationally over the summer with AZ's law. It SEEMS to me that in November, constitutional carry showed up on the radar in Wisconsin, and it SEEMS TO ME that over the past 6 months, constitutional carry went from a little spot on the radar to the LOOMING MASS of gust-front storm that WILL make its way across Wisconsin.

With every day that goes by, the odds of constitutional carry over shall-issue increase.

It seems to me that what use to be the odd-on-favorite (shall-issue) is now IN THE RING with constitutional carry.

So snake, PLEASE don't be offended by the attitudes of people here. We are on your team. Just understand that you are standing amongst a group of people who never took "no" for an answer and who never listened to anyone who said "can't be done".

You are standing amongst a group of people who didn't just WANT to do things that people said couldn't be done, they DID them.

Its truly no offense to you at all, but when you suggest that it "seems" to you like we will end up with shall-issue. You're not going to find a warm reception here.

So please don't get defensive. I honestly don't know what you expected when you made your post, but we are a group that has a proclivity to reject pessimism with results to show for having done so.