@ DSK: I spent 2 days stewing about you. You were rude to me, but since someone, (Rule #6) conveniently didn't go back and read the post, that's that.
You might be interested to know (or perhaps it doesn't matter in your world) that I recently did a training for leos from all over the state on gun law issues. A big part of my training was making the point that open carry is not a reason for a Terry stop, nor does it satisfy the elements of any criminal charge (confused and ill-informed officers like to use inducing panic or disturbing the peace, but both have additional elements that are not present just because somebody has a gun).
I've been contacted by several individuals about how your training goes in the class room. It goes well. Problem is, in the field the rookie is then retrained by the 18 year veteran, who tell's 'em to forget that classroom crap and do it old school, as long as the paper work looks good the Chief will back us. This is the reason we carry voice recorders. Your training is nothing more than a formality, red tape, to get out to the field and soon forgotten.
Maybe you could tell me if this training was a one time thing or have you done this since open carriers started getting harassed?
You might also be interested to know I've been involved in some gun rights litigation. I've testified in support of pro-gun bills. I try and answer most legal questions that come from OFCC members via email. I've assisted agencies wanting to bring their policies in line with State law (which OFCC manages to change with some regularity).
Gun rights litigation, does this mean 'on behalf of someone harassed for OC?' Testifying at the Capitol is admirable. Chuck tells me you were great, I believe he testified too. We still have the obligation to 'notify' to LEO as to CC. Maybe that will be addressed sometime, its been eight years now.
I actually open carry myself from time-to-time.
C'mon, PITP doesn't count. I understand the park's posted, 'no guns'. With all the resources at your command, are you really reaching your full potential?
dsk said:
What is this supposed to mean:
How on earth does a cop know a citizen is armed if he is not OCing? Or, more accurately, how does another citizen know that a citizen is CCing and then reports that to LE? If 'concealed' means 'concealed' there can be no call made to LE. So, how does a LEO know that you are armed? You were referring to OC in your article, denying it here and now is not good.
You asking me? I think he called you a liar...
But I'm sorry. I'll try harder to be part of the solution.
If this is a apology for being rude, I'll take it. If not, its not important to me that you do. It goes as to your character. I had no intention to start a argument or pick a fight. I don't care what Werz says.
You might be interested to know (or perhaps it doesn't matter in your world). Chuck's been keeping a record of what we've done at OCA.
Dick's Sporting Goods, Aurora:
Douglas Nehez was asked to leave while OCing in the store. Jeff Slack sent several emails, resulting an apology to Doug and written verification by corporate that OC is welcome there. Not only were apologies given, assurance was given that All stores, not only in Ohio, but in every OC state, associates were to be given training that OC was legal and welcome.
Sandusky Mall:
Tom Glassburner emailed the mall asking for clarification regarding their signage, against the advice of many. The property manager e mailed Tom a clarification that stated that CHL holders are indeed welcome.
Alliance City council: Werz, Jeff Slack, and Dave Noice attended a city council meeting that resulted in the city council voiding their illegal city ordnance per ORC 9.68 Werz did most of the talking (good job) and he is not a member here.
Very nice shirts designed by Jennifer McCombs
Waverly Ohio: Several attended Bill Neiman's trial and overfilled the court room. Approximately 45 empty holsters in the Court room.
Garfield Heights PD:
After Josha Mucha was told by the PD that OCing would get him arrested. After a couple of E-mails to the Chief, I was assured his officers would be trained,and an OC picnic was held.
K-Mart, Lorain.
Gun buster signs posted. After several e mails and live chat with Sears Holding Co. signs were removed.
Lorain County Metro Parks.
Parks were posted with 'no guns' signage. After a weeks corrospondance signs were removed and I was assured by the Directors secretary, rangers were to be trained.
Giant Eagle:
2 of our member were harassed by LEO posing as security guards at two different stores. I spoke to the district manager for loss prevention. He assured me that this won't happen again, and that oc was indeed welcome in all their stores.
Village of Batavia, Taste of Clermont.
Signage posted on city streets. Letters sent, organizers were advised as to compliance with 9.68. Organizers will take under advisement.
We are currently working on a Chic-Fil-A store that is posted and Lorain County Agricultural Society to see about getting the signage removed at the Lorain County Fair.
Between your teachings and O (oops, rule #12) efforts to support gun rights of OC and CC, we keep busy. I know this isn't much compared to what you do, babysitting the forum and all, but we try.