Which is the best "Ladies" gun?

[asforme]

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Here's a good article by a lady "gun nut" on good techniques to racking the slide for ladies.

The gist of it is to use your body, not just your arms.

http://corneredcat.com/RunGun/rack.aspx

 

[XD40coyote]

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I rackedan XD slide today just fine and I hurt my right wrist the other day and its still sore and goofy. Left is a little goofy too. I used to have carpal tunnel pretty bad but had a chiropractor work on my neck which was out of whack and my carpal tunnel pretty much went away and has been this way over a year. ButI still get soreness and little pains when I overdo it on something.

But I guess my grip and general strength are higher than for most women.I used to work out and I also carry heavy things and do alot of hard detail with my hands like wringing the water out of wet hides.

 

[Bravo_Sierra]

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Glock 26 for CC GLock 19 for OC.

 

[Kendo_Bunny]

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I just have extremely small hands, and a tendency towards tendonitis in both wrists and pinkies. I also can't hold my arms straight very well

Even so, I love my revolver.

 

[Weak 9mm]

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Glock 26 for CC GLock 19 for OC.

Yeah I'd go for a combo like this, because you can use your mid size or full size Glock magazines in the G26 if needed. Also add a DPM mechanical or magnetic/mechanical recoil reducing spring and guide rod to both, and you'll have two extremely reliable (My Glock 17 has never had a single failure) and very easy to handle handguns. The 9mm is just as good as a .40S&W or .45ACP IMO. If you look at actual real world performance, and not just the numbers, you'll find that with good ammo the 9mm will expand and penetrate very similarly to the other two. It's interesting that it manages to do this with lighter bullets and a smaller case, but bullet design is so good these days that there really isn't a lot of difference.

The 9mm and .40S&W are nearly identical in expansion and penetration when using good ammo, the .45ACP does edge the other two out, barely. I don't think it's enough to warrant the reduced magazine capacity, increased recoil, and significantly increased cost of ammo. Check out http://www.brassfetcher.com for a few tests of all these calibers (And more) using various types of ammo.

Pay careful attention to the length of the barrel used in testing when you look at ammo manufacturers numbers (Velocity and muzzle energy). Often .45ACP ammo is tested with a 5" barrel, while 9mm and .40S&W are usually tested with a 4" barrel. Some folks will point out that there's some random round that actually looses velocity as you increase barrel length, but this is not the norm and usually applies to "short barrel" ammo. The vast majority of ammunition will gain velocity with increased barrel length and loose it with decreased barrel length.

The difference in the length of the test barrel really does make a big difference with the .45ACP, which tends to loose more velocity than the other two as barrel length is decreased. I've never understood why they use the 5" barrel (Other than the fact that standard 1911's have 5" BBL's). It makes people who aren't overly observant to the testing conditions think the .45ACP is much more powerful than other two cartriges, when it really isn't that much more powerful. Just because the case is longer and wider doesn't always mean it's more powerful either, case in point being the .38 Special. Anyway, I suggest getting a decent 9mm if she likes it and then get a DPM recoil reducing system. It will create a very controllable, cost effective, high capacity and acceptably "powerful" handgun.

Here is Gunblast's review (And video) of the G26 as well as the DPM recoil reduction system. The video will give you an idea of just how controllable this little Glock can be. I love Gunblast btw, lol. The guy in these reviews seems really nice and quite knowledgeable, I wrote him once and he responded very quickly with useful information.

http://www.gunblast.com/Glock26.htm

Glock 19 review:

http://www.gunblast.com/i_hate_glocks.htm


http://www.gunblast.com/SW_MP9.htm

Above is a review of the S&W M&P 9mm. (For some reason when I write between the above two links it's making everything I write a link regardless of whether or not I want it to be, lol).

A full sized S&W M&P and an M&P compact in 9mm would also be a good combo. Bud's is selling them for very good prices right now. The M&PC in 9mm is currently going for about $440 delivered.

http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/71/products_id/41347

DPM offers recoil reducing system for the M&P also. I would suggest getting night sights or crimson trace laser grips if possible with a carry handgun. Go have her hold and shoot some of these guns and see which ones she likes.

Perhaps the first step would be to rent a .22LR semi-auto handgun, like a Walther or something. Show her how to use it, let her get used to using a semi-auto handgun and then step up to a bit more powerful handgun when she's ready. The .22LR will teach her the basics without being overly powerful or overwhelming. I don't know that you should purchase one, unless you have a lot of money to spend. I will say that the .22LR is a very fun and extremely cheap cartridge, so if you want something for both of you to be able to use then maybe it would be a good buy, but obviously it's not really the best defensive caliber. Cho proved it certainly can be used for killing though. I would suggest renting one and just teaching her the basics with it first. I'd imagne if she likes it she'd want to try out the defensive handgun calibers eventually anyway.

Also, I'd suggest just getting a G17 if you plan to get the G19 for OC and the G26 for CC. You'll get a bit more velocity out of your rounds as well as 2 more rounds in the magazine with the G17, and since concealing wouldn't be the point of that gun, there's no need to go down in size to a G19 IMO. If you can only get one, the G19 may be the best choice. It can be concealed on many people if they choose the right area of their body on which to carry it.

If needed she can add a pierce "pinky" grip extension to one of the G26 mags btw. Then if she needed it to be more concealable, like if she were pocket carrying, she can make that mag her secondary and put the short mag in the gun. If she's carrying IWB or SOB she could probably put the mag with the extension in the gun and use the other as the secondary.


If money is tight, the Bersa 380 is a very good choice. It can be had for about $250 from Bud's Guns, and I'm sure you could get a similar deal at a store. I do suggest using one of a few rounds pretty much exclusively if she's carrying a .380 Auto. The first two are Federal's Hydrashock and Extreme Shock's Fang Face. The Fang Face will probably be the nastiest of all of the rounds in terms of tissue damage. The most powerful rounds you'll find in .380 Auto would be from Buffalo bore and Double Tap. Buffalo Bore is good and very powerful stuff. In the Gunblast review at the bottom of my post you can see some info on it. It gets a 90gr Gold Dot up to 1100fps out of the Bersa (He tested it with a chronograph) and into the mid 200's in terms of Muzzle Energy. Double Tap makes a .380 Auto round using a Gold Dot that should be good and stout too, similar to the Buffalo Bore in performance but cheaper. In fact, Double Tap makes stout ammo for most calibers at a very good price (Their 115gr 9mm Gold Dot reaches 1400+fps, making over 500ft.-lb. of muzzle energy from a G17). Here's the 90gr .380 Auto Gold Dot:

http://www.doubletapammo.com/php/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=21_62&products_id=233

Poor ammo choices in that caliber can result in less than stellar performance though, so be careful and make sure you check out some tests of the ammo (And make sure it functions in the gun) before you start carrying it. FMJ's are also a decent choice in .380 Auto simply because they WILL penetrate more than the "FBI minimum" of 12" corrected in ballistics gelatin. Here's the .380 Auto Hydrashock review, it's performance is spectacular considering it was fired from a 2.75" BBL in this test:

http://www.brassfetcher.com/380acp%2090gr%20Federal%20Hydra-Shok%20(light%20clothing).html

Bud's Guns Bersa .380:

http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/178/products_id/25381

Gunblast Review:

http://www.gunblast.com/Bersa_Thunder380-2.htm

 

[deepdiver]

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Weak9mm, overall great post. However, I'll say the same thing here (with minor editing) as I did in the "never-ending thread" about the 4"-5" .45 ballistics:

The velocity differences between a 4" and 5" .45 barrel, where you can find comparitive data for the same round and the same testing set-up, typically vary from about 10 to 50 fps. A few rds I looked at actually showed a slightly higher fps in the 4" barrel, Speer's short barrel JHP and 230 gr Hydra-shok being two of them. For many if not most SD rounds, the difference is negligible. For the 2 .45 SD rds I carry for example, one loses 10fps and the other loses 6 fps in the only head to head 4"/5" tests I can find, translating to 18 lb-ft and 5 lb-ft, respectively, lost compared to a 5" barrel.

Where I have found a much more significant drop in .45 velocity (again, for those few rounds I can find head to head comparisons) is going to a 3" barrel in .45 with heavier rounds. There are some heavy rounds that lose 40-50 fps 5"-4" with negligible ME, but then lose another 90-100fps 4" to 3" for a total loss of 140-150fps with some 230 gr rounds going low 700s fps in a 3.2" and shorter barrel. Most of this seems mitigated if you stick to 165/185 gr loads in sub-4" .45s. Winchester 185 gr silvertip, an excellent peformer typically, is one of the few lighter grain rounds that does horribly in a short barrel, in some tests losing nearly 150 fps 5" to 3" barrel.

ETA: I know the conventional wisdom is that fat and heavy needs a long barrel to get moving, but I think modern cartridge design has mitigated most of this from what I can find. I don't mean to take this OT, however, I did want to respond to that part of Weak9mm's post.

 

[Weak 9mm]

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I can definitely see that happening with certain rounds. Good post, watching out for the .45ACP owners.

Also note that I do plan on owning a handgun chambered in .45ACP, but it will probably be the classic .45ACP handgun, the 1911. For some reason I think that cartridge deserves to be fed to a 1911.

 

[KimEdi1350]

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I am just about the same size as your girlfriend 5'7" 120lbs, very small framed, so I understand where you are coming from exactly. Now I am going to assume this is for her to carry all the time for protection. For that I would suggest the Taurus MODEL 617 .357 MAG. REVOLVER. Have her use .38 in it as the weight will help with the kick, the bonus it holds 7 rounds. After that, take her (or at the very least set her up somewhere) where she can go and shot on a regular basis. That is the key
I never keep mine in my purse as I feel that is one of the dumbest things a woman can do, it is meant to protect your person not your purse. When it comes down to that moment trust me dont want to have to dig through your purse to find your gun, as most scumbags are not to willing to give you a minute so you can find your gun to shoot him with. Teach her to shoot to kill, I was taught to aim and fire like it was my only bullet, that is why taking her to shoot on a regular basis is so important, she has to become totally comfortable with it, from the draw to the aim to pulling that trigger. Revolvers are best since you wont worry about jams and you keep your brass. (always best, even in a self defense situation)
Hope this helps

 

[brolin_1911a1]

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Both of the women in my life are good shots and can handle and shoot my 1911 .45ACP well but don't care for it; they find the grip too large although I've thought that possibly a shorter trigger might help.

I've a Walther PPK/S in .380ACP and neither of the women (my wife and my daughter) care for it either; the stiff recoil spring necessitated by the blowback action makes it difficult to rack the slide and makes the recoil too "snappy" for comfort. The same for the Taurus PT140; both women claim that the recoil is too stout for comfort.

Both ladies like the Steyr M9 and S9 9mm pistols and have no trouble with the Browning HP although, like the older JMB design, the grip is too large for comfort. But 9mm seems to be a caliber they can handle and shoot well and comfortably. They don't care for the difficulty of racking the slide on most semi-autos, though.

That said, both ladies do well with a 4" Ruger Security-Six, even shooting full-house .357 Magnum loads. In fact, that's my wife's favorite. Their second-most favorite is a S&W mod. 36 snubbie; both women can hit cantaloupes at 15yds with that gun. My daughter's carry piece is a Kel-Tec P11 9mm; the grip size and overall balance just fit her well and she's scary accurate with it.

Final conclusion? There is no predicting what gun/cartridge combo will best suit a particular woman until and unless she's handled and shot enough to know what feels good to her. Look on it as a great reason to visit ranges and shoot lots of guns. And check out Kathy Jackson's website, http://corneredcat.com for great reading on the topic.

 

[SlowDog]

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Ok...I know this is kind of an old thread and was wondering what was eventually decided on and purchased. For me I am an old hand carrying a Springfield 1911A1 in you guessed it...45acp.

Bought my wife a Bersa 380 plus 15+1. Fits her just fine. And for all you girly men out there....here is my 8 year old and his favorite weapon...yup Dad's 1911A1 45acp!!!

Makes me soooo proud!!:quirky:quirky:lol::lol: